Comments on: Ministerial Vestments and Being a “Marked People”

By: By Common Consent » In the colonies, the locals quietly rebel against imperial attire

Sun, 17 Sep 2006 15:51:01 +0000

[...] Seth R. has a good post on the white-shirt-and-tie as a “ministerial vestment.” I’m very almost persuaded, but there’s still a touch of “dress like white man” about it. [...]

By: Steve EM

Steve EM — Fri, 25 Aug 2006 17:20:35 +0000

Seth,
You make a good point that what worked for me may not work for everyone, which is part of the reason I’ve just let my son to find his own way. He serves in a mission near you and is having a much tougher time than I did in Western Europe, even though there is a solid church foundation chez vous. Moreover, his Pres is a real winner and missionaries go or are sent home at the drop of a hat in his mission. In my mission, if you went home it was because you were dying. He has 8 months to go, and I’m proud he’s stuck it out this long but, honestly, I doubt I could serve in his mission. Given that many of my post mission difficulties came about because my mission ended on a sour note (another story), I worry for my son as he’s had far fewer positive experiences than I did.

Back to uniform, if you don’t think a guy wearing a dress shirt and tie riding a bike isn’t cultish and not something a person trying to make a good impression would do, we live on different planets. I’m all for bike riding missionaries to keep transportation expenses down, but the uniform should match the task and the times.

By: meems

meems — Fri, 25 Aug 2006 04:42:38 +0000

I like the missionary uniform and being able to easily identify a church member or missionary in an unfamiliar place. It makes me feel safe. I love seeing missionaries in airports and on the streets in a city. I don’t know how non-members feel, but as a member, it’s a way to quickly and fairly accurately spot a priesthood holder. You never know when you’ll need one!

By: Seth R.

Seth R. — Fri, 25 Aug 2006 04:31:25 +0000

I’d be careful about generalizing your own personalized style of proselyting to everyone else Steve. Knowing very little about you personally, I would venture to say that I knew several missionaries who had something resembling the approach you’ve described. It worked well for them. But my general experience was that it didn’t always work out for everyone else in the mission (or even for most of the missionaries).

And while I wouldn’t argue that there are many “outsiders” who would have the sort of “first impression” you describe, I would be a little more skeptical about making the claim that such reactions are typical of all, or even most Americans.

By: Hal H.

Hal H. — Thu, 24 Aug 2006 23:31:49 +0000

I agree with you about baptismal goals. We don’t control that - its between them and the Lord. When missionaries feel pressure to produce baptismal numbers they become contrived and manipulative. I disagree with your characterization of missionary dress as ‘cultish geek’. They do stand out but I don’t think most people interpret it as a geeky thing. Apparently some do.

By: Steve EM

Steve EM — Thu, 24 Aug 2006 23:02:26 +0000

Hal,
They never get to hear the gospel if their first impression is “cultish dork”. It’s like dating, the first step is superficial attraction; without that first step, you never get to a relationship, let alone marriage. A good first impression leads some people to listen. That leads to teaching, and some people we teach progress and join. I feel baptismal goals were bad becuase it’s supposed to be a free unpressured choice. But intermediate goals like contact and teaching numbers are good. On my mission casual hard working missionaries taught the most, and the key was first impression. In time, things may swing back to more formality, but right now, in western countries, our missionary uniform is hurting us.

By: Hal H.

Hal H. — Thu, 24 Aug 2006 22:08:36 +0000

Steve EM,
The gospel has little to do with ‘first impressions’, but rather, impressions that come after time and effort. One of my frustrations seems to be the opposite of what your are saying. Mine is the occassional mission president who treats baptisms like selling widgits: the more the better and it doesn’t matter how they come. Training meetings turn into salesmanship meetings. Missionaries talk about being ‘pumped up’ and ‘on fire’. Often ‘fantastic’ programs are involved with unfounded promises attached to them. My inner bells start ringing when I run across this. Gratefully, most presidents don’t seem to take this approach anymore. I think PREACH MY GOSPEL has had a good influence. Steve, when did the church start to shrink?

By: Steve EM

Steve EM — Thu, 24 Aug 2006 19:04:27 +0000

Putting aside the fashion faux pas of backpack/suits/ties/short sleeves, the current uniform combined with bike riding is period clothing last seen in the 1920’s in the western countries. And religions that practice period clothing are indeed weird and typically not involved in serious outreach/missionary efforts. As I’ve commented elsewhere, most teaching opportunities on my mission a generation ago were found when I was out of uniform on the golf course. And we are so much more casual today, the situation is much worse. There are many reasons the church is shrinking and this is one of them.

It all comes down to first impressions, and what works in one time or country usually won’t work in another time or place. Most of our bike riding missionaries today, at least in western countries, are utterly wasting their’s and the Lord’s time out there. I clean polo shirt, cotton slacks and casual shoes would go much better with the bike and helmet (we didn’t have the helmets nor backpacks on my mission).

For the record, I have a son on a mission now, and I don’t share these views with him so as not to undermine his motivation, not encourage disobedience to his Pres and let him find his own way. But I am very sad for him that he hasn’t found nearly as many receptive people as I did, and I served in what many LDS feel is a mission hell hole.

I also found the old book How to Win Friends and Influence People was by far the most useful book on my mission, better than anything on the approved list, but that’s a whole other story.

By: Bret

Bret — Wed, 23 Aug 2006 05:16:11 +0000

Great post, Seth! A couple different thoughts…

I think you hit it right on. The last decade or so we’ve spent so much effort trying to be neighborly and more inclusive that we’ve turned it into “lets fit in all we can and not be pushy with our beliefs.” It’s a hard balance to find between being inclusive and neighborly and still be forward enough to stand up for our beliefs and missionary mindset.

Second in response to your last comment, I find myself becoming like your father. I used to wear my most outrageous ties to church when I knew I’d be in the limelight at church somehow. (singing in sacrament, teaching a lesson, etc. In HS once I even wore a Charlie Brown look-a-like sweater when I blessed the sacrament) Now I try to do the opposite. Take the attention off of me and onto the messege I’m trying to express. Nitpicky? Sure, but it makes a difference; at least for me

By: Jon in Austin

Jon in Austin — Wed, 23 Aug 2006 02:24:50 +0000

Re. 2

You go wear anything other than a short-sleeved white shirt as a missionary anywhere south of the U.S. I’dve died within two hours if my suit didn’t get retired at the welcome dinner at the mission home in northern Brazil.