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	<title>Comments on: Old People</title>
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		<title>By: john f.</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242&#038;cpage=1#comment-92592</link>
		<dc:creator>john f.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Oct 2010 12:48:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242#comment-92592</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve heard that some temples require people to shave beards to be veil workers. If that is true, would a temple actually ask a 75 year old convert of 5 to 10 years to shave off his clean-cut, well kept white beard (picture Heber J. Grant style beard) in order to be a veil worker? It makes reason stare.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve heard that some temples require people to shave beards to be veil workers. If that is true, would a temple actually ask a 75 year old convert of 5 to 10 years to shave off his clean-cut, well kept white beard (picture Heber J. Grant style beard) in order to be a veil worker? It makes reason stare.</p>
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		<title>By: john f.</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242&#038;cpage=1#comment-92415</link>
		<dc:creator>john f.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Oct 2010 14:08:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242#comment-92415</guid>
		<description>I see the real &quot;problem&quot; as being not with the elderly in wards but rather with the middle-management types, who are invariably the types called into priesthood leadership positions. They are the people interested in having church meetings look like IBM board meetings circa 1955.

From my perspective, the white-haired 75 year old with a beard in the ward isn&#039;t the one who has an issue with beards. It&#039;s the 45-50 year old Stake President or bishop who works as a management consultant and went to BYU at any time after Ernest Wilkinson&#039;s tenure as the university president.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I see the real &#8220;problem&#8221; as being not with the elderly in wards but rather with the middle-management types, who are invariably the types called into priesthood leadership positions. They are the people interested in having church meetings look like IBM board meetings circa 1955.</p>
<p>From my perspective, the white-haired 75 year old with a beard in the ward isn&#8217;t the one who has an issue with beards. It&#8217;s the 45-50 year old Stake President or bishop who works as a management consultant and went to BYU at any time after Ernest Wilkinson&#8217;s tenure as the university president.</p>
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		<title>By: john f.</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242&#038;cpage=1#comment-92413</link>
		<dc:creator>john f.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Oct 2010 14:01:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242#comment-92413</guid>
		<description>Marjorie, so this guy&#039;s in your ward:

http://www.theonion.com/articles/man-already-knows-everything-he-needs-to-know-abou,17990/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Marjorie, so this guy&#8217;s in your ward:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.theonion.com/articles/man-already-knows-everything-he-needs-to-know-abou,17990/" rel="nofollow">http://www.theonion.com/articles/man-already-knows-everything-he-needs-to-know-abou,17990/</a></p>
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		<title>By: Martin</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242&#038;cpage=1#comment-91825</link>
		<dc:creator>Martin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Sep 2010 01:28:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242#comment-91825</guid>
		<description>The funny thing is, the old people in my ward seem to be less outspoken and judgmental than the younger ones.  Of course, our old people are like the ones Susan M describes -- they&#039;ve been around and seen a lot, and consequently seem to have decided they don&#039;t know all the answers.  They tend to strike a temperate tone in what they say.

I think the outdated thinking gets passed from generation to generation by the 30-40 year-old parents more than the older people.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The funny thing is, the old people in my ward seem to be less outspoken and judgmental than the younger ones.  Of course, our old people are like the ones Susan M describes &#8212; they&#8217;ve been around and seen a lot, and consequently seem to have decided they don&#8217;t know all the answers.  They tend to strike a temperate tone in what they say.</p>
<p>I think the outdated thinking gets passed from generation to generation by the 30-40 year-old parents more than the older people.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242&#038;cpage=1#comment-91775</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Sep 2010 00:29:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242#comment-91775</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve been back in the Wasatch Front ward of my youth for three weeks now.  I definitely agree that it&#039;s comforting to be surrounded by people with all those years of accumulated wisdom after being in an inner city east coast ward for the past five years or so.  This particular ward doesn&#039;t quite have the downside of oldness that other wards have, but it is missing a certain diversity of viewpoint, I think.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve been back in the Wasatch Front ward of my youth for three weeks now.  I definitely agree that it&#8217;s comforting to be surrounded by people with all those years of accumulated wisdom after being in an inner city east coast ward for the past five years or so.  This particular ward doesn&#8217;t quite have the downside of oldness that other wards have, but it is missing a certain diversity of viewpoint, I think.</p>
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		<title>By: Don</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242&#038;cpage=1#comment-91755</link>
		<dc:creator>Don</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Sep 2010 21:19:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242#comment-91755</guid>
		<description>Being one of the &quot;oldies&quot; of our ward, there is much truth in what Rusty said.

I love our ward and have been in it longer than any other ward member (except my wife).  Our ward is well balanced with a strong primary and very strong youth.  I think there is a certain strength that comes with a wide variety of ages and backgrounds.

Part of who Rusty is and what he has become is because of the ward he grew up in.  I think that has also contributed to his present viewpoints.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Being one of the &#8220;oldies&#8221; of our ward, there is much truth in what Rusty said.</p>
<p>I love our ward and have been in it longer than any other ward member (except my wife).  Our ward is well balanced with a strong primary and very strong youth.  I think there is a certain strength that comes with a wide variety of ages and backgrounds.</p>
<p>Part of who Rusty is and what he has become is because of the ward he grew up in.  I think that has also contributed to his present viewpoints.</p>
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		<title>By: Susan M</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242&#038;cpage=1#comment-91750</link>
		<dc:creator>Susan M</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Sep 2010 14:37:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242#comment-91750</guid>
		<description>I used to live in a small town in Washington that was a retirement community. Very few young families in the ward--most of the ward were older retired people.

It was the best ward ever.

Sure it was hard to keep the Primary staffed, but the Spirit in that ward was so strong, it was amazing. My husband was re-activated while we lived there and he always says he probably would not have come back to church in any other ward. When he started coming back to church, no one made a big deal about it. No pressure on him. Just friendly faces and greetings and open arms.

He told me once during a F&amp;T meeting that he felt the Spirit so strongly he wanted to stand up and ask people if Christ was in the room.

I think one of the reasons the Spirit was so strong in that ward was that a lot of the retired people attended the temple weekly. It was three hours away but they carpooled.

Also, you&#039;d think a ward full of old white people wouldn&#039;t be very diverse, but it was. Because everyone had retired there from somewhere else, we had a rich pool of experiences and backgrounds. It was neat. There was a lady who was so classy and elegant--and she grew up in a shack in Alabama with no running water. Another woman had been a model and hostess during WWII and had entertained celebrities at a restaurant and later worked building airplanes. I loved that ward.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I used to live in a small town in Washington that was a retirement community. Very few young families in the ward&#8211;most of the ward were older retired people.</p>
<p>It was the best ward ever.</p>
<p>Sure it was hard to keep the Primary staffed, but the Spirit in that ward was so strong, it was amazing. My husband was re-activated while we lived there and he always says he probably would not have come back to church in any other ward. When he started coming back to church, no one made a big deal about it. No pressure on him. Just friendly faces and greetings and open arms.</p>
<p>He told me once during a F&amp;T meeting that he felt the Spirit so strongly he wanted to stand up and ask people if Christ was in the room.</p>
<p>I think one of the reasons the Spirit was so strong in that ward was that a lot of the retired people attended the temple weekly. It was three hours away but they carpooled.</p>
<p>Also, you&#8217;d think a ward full of old white people wouldn&#8217;t be very diverse, but it was. Because everyone had retired there from somewhere else, we had a rich pool of experiences and backgrounds. It was neat. There was a lady who was so classy and elegant&#8211;and she grew up in a shack in Alabama with no running water. Another woman had been a model and hostess during WWII and had entertained celebrities at a restaurant and later worked building airplanes. I loved that ward.</p>
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		<title>By: Travis</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242&#038;cpage=1#comment-91736</link>
		<dc:creator>Travis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Sep 2010 04:08:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242#comment-91736</guid>
		<description>All the old people leave Brooklyn and move to Westchester.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All the old people leave Brooklyn and move to Westchester.</p>
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		<title>By: Marjorie Conder</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242&#038;cpage=1#comment-91731</link>
		<dc:creator>Marjorie Conder</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Sep 2010 02:00:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242#comment-91731</guid>
		<description>I agree with Kim. We were in southern Alberta earlier this summer, then visiting our son in southern Illinois and our daughter&#039;s young ward in West Jordan Utah. All these wards seemed much more &quot;hidebound&quot; than our Utah ward. The average age in these other wards also seemed much younger than our present ward, especially the West Jordan ward. 

i believe that a few &quot;catalyst&quot; people, of any age, can make all the difference. I can think of about 12 of these types of people over the years. i believe my husband and I have been two of these people. Ironically some of these catalyst types largely conform to the outward stereotype, in appearance, etc. themselves, but they are very accepting of a broad range of people and opinions. 

Finally another example and thought. A couple of months ago a new young couple spoke in Sac. Mtg. He had a beard and hair down past his shoulders. Several weeks later he still had his beard but his hair was short. I don&#039;t know of anyone who said anything to him about it. Maybe he just wanted to see if we would &quot;accept him as he was&quot; and since we did, he had no further need to make a &quot;statement&quot; with his long hair.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with Kim. We were in southern Alberta earlier this summer, then visiting our son in southern Illinois and our daughter&#8217;s young ward in West Jordan Utah. All these wards seemed much more &#8220;hidebound&#8221; than our Utah ward. The average age in these other wards also seemed much younger than our present ward, especially the West Jordan ward. </p>
<p>i believe that a few &#8220;catalyst&#8221; people, of any age, can make all the difference. I can think of about 12 of these types of people over the years. i believe my husband and I have been two of these people. Ironically some of these catalyst types largely conform to the outward stereotype, in appearance, etc. themselves, but they are very accepting of a broad range of people and opinions. </p>
<p>Finally another example and thought. A couple of months ago a new young couple spoke in Sac. Mtg. He had a beard and hair down past his shoulders. Several weeks later he still had his beard but his hair was short. I don&#8217;t know of anyone who said anything to him about it. Maybe he just wanted to see if we would &#8220;accept him as he was&#8221; and since we did, he had no further need to make a &#8220;statement&#8221; with his long hair.</p>
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		<title>By: Kim Siever</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242&#038;cpage=1#comment-91730</link>
		<dc:creator>Kim Siever</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Sep 2010 00:45:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=1242#comment-91730</guid>
		<description>Rusty, your description of Utah wards sounds like wards in Lethbridge.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rusty, your description of Utah wards sounds like wards in Lethbridge.</p>
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