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	<title>Comments on: Proof that the bloggernacle is evil</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.nine-moons.com/?feed=rss2&#038;p=126" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126</link>
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		<title>By: a random John</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126&#038;cpage=1#comment-363</link>
		<dc:creator>a random John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jul 2005 06:45:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126#comment-363</guid>
		<description>Ned,

Great post.  What is interesting to me is that your very own ward is probably full of people that think those very same things but they won&#039;t say them in gospel doctrine.  I know that there are several people in my ward with very interesting viewpoints, but when it comes to participation they almost never say anything that would cause you to think that they are anything other than fully correllated.

I like to think that I am my same self in meetings and willing to really say what I think, but I am not.  We had a lesson a week or two ago on the Word of Wisdom and I didn&#039;t say a word.  Well, I did have my hand up at one point, but I didn&#039;t get called on and didn&#039;t want to push the issue.

The social expectations of church are such that lots of people will say things that make them look the same as everybody else.  Probably because they know how uncomfortable any trace of contention is.

For example, ask Tess what she thought of me six or so months ago.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ned,</p>
<p>Great post.  What is interesting to me is that your very own ward is probably full of people that think those very same things but they won&#8217;t say them in gospel doctrine.  I know that there are several people in my ward with very interesting viewpoints, but when it comes to participation they almost never say anything that would cause you to think that they are anything other than fully correllated.</p>
<p>I like to think that I am my same self in meetings and willing to really say what I think, but I am not.  We had a lesson a week or two ago on the Word of Wisdom and I didn&#8217;t say a word.  Well, I did have my hand up at one point, but I didn&#8217;t get called on and didn&#8217;t want to push the issue.</p>
<p>The social expectations of church are such that lots of people will say things that make them look the same as everybody else.  Probably because they know how uncomfortable any trace of contention is.</p>
<p>For example, ask Tess what she thought of me six or so months ago.</p>
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		<title>By: NFlanders</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126&#038;cpage=1#comment-362</link>
		<dc:creator>NFlanders</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jul 2005 18:36:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126#comment-362</guid>
		<description>Tess-- I don&#039;t know if meeting &quot;normal&quot; Mormons would help me acquire a testimony of the gospel. It couldn&#039;t hurt. Belief is a very private thing, but social interactions do affect our perceptions. Somehow, seeing reasonable people believe, despite doubts and concerns similar to mine, makes my own belief more plausible.

The problem, of course, is that I could never interact with people in real life the same way as we do online. Church just isn&#039;t the place where concerns and doubts are aired.

As for my future activity, I truly don&#039;t know. I am moving soon, and I guess I&#039;ll have to feel out the new ward. I&#039;m not big on social commitments and unfortunately, callings seem to be the main reactivation tool.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tess&#8211; I don&#8217;t know if meeting &#8220;normal&#8221; Mormons would help me acquire a testimony of the gospel. It couldn&#8217;t hurt. Belief is a very private thing, but social interactions do affect our perceptions. Somehow, seeing reasonable people believe, despite doubts and concerns similar to mine, makes my own belief more plausible.</p>
<p>The problem, of course, is that I could never interact with people in real life the same way as we do online. Church just isn&#8217;t the place where concerns and doubts are aired.</p>
<p>As for my future activity, I truly don&#8217;t know. I am moving soon, and I guess I&#8217;ll have to feel out the new ward. I&#8217;m not big on social commitments and unfortunately, callings seem to be the main reactivation tool.</p>
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		<title>By: Laura</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126&#038;cpage=1#comment-361</link>
		<dc:creator>Laura</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jul 2005 18:08:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126#comment-361</guid>
		<description>I meant to say: &lt;i&gt;We were inactive for a number of years (although we never &lt;b&gt;totally&lt;/b&gt; stopped going)&lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I meant to say: <i>We were inactive for a number of years (although we never <b>totally</b> stopped going)</i></p>
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		<title>By: Laura</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126&#038;cpage=1#comment-360</link>
		<dc:creator>Laura</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jul 2005 18:06:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126#comment-360</guid>
		<description>Ned,
Great post.  I went through a similar time (you can read the extendo version &lt;a href=&quot;http://lchan.blogspot.com/2005/03/my-mormonism.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;), but without the help of the &#039;nacle.  My situation is different from yours because my husband is also a Mormon, but we were bothing questioning the church.

We were inactive for a number of years (although we never stopped going) and we tried out a few other churches.  None of them felt right.  Our church didn&#039;t really feel right, either (since I no longer believed it) but it felt like &lt;b&gt;our church&lt;/b&gt;.  

We wanted our family to be a church-going family, so we went back to church.  At first, we were just totally cultural mormons.  And sometimes I still feel like that, but I&#039;m ok with that.  Sometimes I can actually let myself believe it.  

Truthfully, the most important thing to me is my Christianity, not my Mormonism.  But I&#039;m most comfortable with the Mormon brand of Christianity.

Also, I was surprised that Mormons were less black/white than I thought them to be.  Whenever I would mention my inactivity, there was almost always someone else who had always been inactive, too.

As far as blogs, sometimes the &#039;nacle brings up crap I don&#039;t want to deal with, but overall I think it&#039;s a great place.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ned,<br />
Great post.  I went through a similar time (you can read the extendo version <a href="http://lchan.blogspot.com/2005/03/my-mormonism.html" rel="nofollow">here</a>), but without the help of the &#8216;nacle.  My situation is different from yours because my husband is also a Mormon, but we were bothing questioning the church.</p>
<p>We were inactive for a number of years (although we never stopped going) and we tried out a few other churches.  None of them felt right.  Our church didn&#8217;t really feel right, either (since I no longer believed it) but it felt like <b>our church</b>.  </p>
<p>We wanted our family to be a church-going family, so we went back to church.  At first, we were just totally cultural mormons.  And sometimes I still feel like that, but I&#8217;m ok with that.  Sometimes I can actually let myself believe it.  </p>
<p>Truthfully, the most important thing to me is my Christianity, not my Mormonism.  But I&#8217;m most comfortable with the Mormon brand of Christianity.</p>
<p>Also, I was surprised that Mormons were less black/white than I thought them to be.  Whenever I would mention my inactivity, there was almost always someone else who had always been inactive, too.</p>
<p>As far as blogs, sometimes the &#8216;nacle brings up crap I don&#8217;t want to deal with, but overall I think it&#8217;s a great place.</p>
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		<title>By: Tess</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126&#038;cpage=1#comment-359</link>
		<dc:creator>Tess</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jul 2005 16:32:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126#comment-359</guid>
		<description>Yeah, we don&#039;t want to get anyone thrown out of Church for personal apostacy because of their participation on the bloggernacle!  Does anyone think that could happen?

Anyway, back to the point of the post.  It&#039;s interesting you&#039;re coming back to Church, Ned, because of your experience in the bloggernacle.  So, if you were somehow able to connect with the normal Mormons out there in the real world (as opposed to the cyber Mormons online), do you think you would be able to acquire (or reacquire) a testimony of the truthfulness of the gospel? 

I read your post to imply that you might already know the truth of the gospel, but since the Mormon culture is very much &quot;untrue&quot;, you have decided not to be an active Mormon. 

Also, do you see yourself ever progressing from sitting in the back pew to becoming more engaged in your ward?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, we don&#8217;t want to get anyone thrown out of Church for personal apostacy because of their participation on the bloggernacle!  Does anyone think that could happen?</p>
<p>Anyway, back to the point of the post.  It&#8217;s interesting you&#8217;re coming back to Church, Ned, because of your experience in the bloggernacle.  So, if you were somehow able to connect with the normal Mormons out there in the real world (as opposed to the cyber Mormons online), do you think you would be able to acquire (or reacquire) a testimony of the truthfulness of the gospel? </p>
<p>I read your post to imply that you might already know the truth of the gospel, but since the Mormon culture is very much &#8220;untrue&#8221;, you have decided not to be an active Mormon. </p>
<p>Also, do you see yourself ever progressing from sitting in the back pew to becoming more engaged in your ward?</p>
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		<title>By: NFlanders</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126&#038;cpage=1#comment-358</link>
		<dc:creator>NFlanders</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jul 2005 16:07:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126#comment-358</guid>
		<description>Uh oh, Rusty. I hope I didn&#039;t slander you. I really thought it was you. Unfortunately, T&amp;S doesn&#039;t let you search for comments. I will investigate (and sorry for that &quot;personal apostasy&quot; crack).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Uh oh, Rusty. I hope I didn&#8217;t slander you. I really thought it was you. Unfortunately, T&amp;S doesn&#8217;t let you search for comments. I will investigate (and sorry for that &#8220;personal apostasy&#8221; crack).</p>
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		<title>By: Rusty</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126&#038;cpage=1#comment-357</link>
		<dc:creator>Rusty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jul 2005 08:02:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126#comment-357</guid>
		<description>Ned,
Great post. Thanks for sharing your experience here. I think that&#039;s one of the reasons I like the &#039;nacle as well, that there are others out there that think like me. Though I must say, I&#039;m pretty sure that wasn&#039;t me that made that comment about BKP. I don&#039;t remember ever thinking that. Do you have any recollection of which post that was said on? I think I remember reading it though. 

Anyway, regardless, I&#039;m glad you found your way here. I always appreciate your perspective and insight. And I&#039;m also happy you&#039;ve come to realize that we are all not that much different.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ned,<br />
Great post. Thanks for sharing your experience here. I think that&#8217;s one of the reasons I like the &#8216;nacle as well, that there are others out there that think like me. Though I must say, I&#8217;m pretty sure that wasn&#8217;t me that made that comment about BKP. I don&#8217;t remember ever thinking that. Do you have any recollection of which post that was said on? I think I remember reading it though. </p>
<p>Anyway, regardless, I&#8217;m glad you found your way here. I always appreciate your perspective and insight. And I&#8217;m also happy you&#8217;ve come to realize that we are all not that much different.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve (FSF)</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126&#038;cpage=1#comment-356</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve (FSF)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jul 2005 06:02:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126#comment-356</guid>
		<description>&quot;I pretty much disregard everything that some people, like Boyd K. Packer, say.&quot;

Other great post Ned.  Rusty sure gets away w/ a lot.  People get so bent out of shape when I say I&#039;d put money on BKP being a repressed homosexual the way he carries himself, his obsession w/ masturbation, women&#039;s fashion, etc.  I get these angry E-mails saying I&#039;m speaking evil of the Lord&#039;s anointed.  But under church doctrine being a homosexual isn&#039;t a sin, just the act, not the orientation.  Repressed homosexually is a positive under church doctrine.

Anybody know if Monson and BKP get along?  What I’d pay to see a fist fight between two apostles in the temple?  I&#039;d put money that that&#039;s happened too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I pretty much disregard everything that some people, like Boyd K. Packer, say.&#8221;</p>
<p>Other great post Ned.  Rusty sure gets away w/ a lot.  People get so bent out of shape when I say I&#8217;d put money on BKP being a repressed homosexual the way he carries himself, his obsession w/ masturbation, women&#8217;s fashion, etc.  I get these angry E-mails saying I&#8217;m speaking evil of the Lord&#8217;s anointed.  But under church doctrine being a homosexual isn&#8217;t a sin, just the act, not the orientation.  Repressed homosexually is a positive under church doctrine.</p>
<p>Anybody know if Monson and BKP get along?  What I’d pay to see a fist fight between two apostles in the temple?  I&#8217;d put money that that&#8217;s happened too.</p>
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		<title>By: NFlanders</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126&#038;cpage=1#comment-355</link>
		<dc:creator>NFlanders</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jul 2005 02:17:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126#comment-355</guid>
		<description>Wow. I didn&#039;t even realize that was you, Geoff. I appreciated your advice, but being a newbie at the time, I didn&#039;t want to start a thread-jack by responding. Unfortunately, I have no such qualms now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow. I didn&#8217;t even realize that was you, Geoff. I appreciated your advice, but being a newbie at the time, I didn&#8217;t want to start a thread-jack by responding. Unfortunately, I have no such qualms now.</p>
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		<title>By: Geoff J</title>
		<link>http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126&#038;cpage=1#comment-354</link>
		<dc:creator>Geoff J</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jul 2005 02:02:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nine-moons.com/?p=126#comment-354</guid>
		<description>Hey cool -- I was the first one to respond to your first comment over at T&amp;S.  I totally forgot about that thread.  Who knew you would become such a masterful blogger in so short a time?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey cool &#8212; I was the first one to respond to your first comment over at T&amp;S.  I totally forgot about that thread.  Who knew you would become such a masterful blogger in so short a time?</p>
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